[Discuss] Near-space Balloon: A couple more drawings

Dirk Godsey EMAIL HIDDEN
Sun Nov 6 21:21:19 PST 2011


Pics of Laura's payload bay design.


On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 6:56 PM, Laura Harris <EMAIL HIDDEN> wrote:
> Sodium acetate hand warmers don't require oxygen. They're good for about an
> hour. http://www.rewci.com/ez-heat-reusable-hand-warmer.html
> They can also be recharged by boiling them in water. The solution in the
> pouch stays liquid (even when cooled) until you snap the little metal disk
> inside the pouch, then the material crystallizes and releases heat in the
> process. I'm not sure what the reduced air pressure would do to them, though
> as they use a sealed pouch.
>
> The handwarmers that use iron powder, salt, water, and air would probably be
> fine- as noted by Rick.
> L
>
> ________________________________
> From: Rick Osgood <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> To: Ben Hallert - Vipmail <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> Cc: "EMAIL HIDDEN"
> <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> Sent: Sunday, November 6, 2011 4:21 PM
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] Near-space Balloon: A couple more drawings
>
> If the chassis is well insulated, then the hand warmers only have to work
> for a brief period of time to warm up the air on the inside of the payload.
>  If they stop working due to lack of oxygen then it won't matter because the
> air inside will already be warm.  Of course this only matters if the payload
> is insulated well enough.
>
> On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 1:42 PM, Ben Hallert - Vipmail <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> wrote:
>
> Are there warmers that use a contained chemical reactions?
>
> - Ben
> On Nov 6, 2011, at 1:16 PM, James Hukill <EMAIL HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> Hand warmers require oxygen as the catalyst*,  which might mean they don't'
> work at the height would would need them too? (Not sure O2 levels at that
> height)
> Would be cool point to prove, blast a few packets of hard warmers with pure
> oxygen and see if they light up?
>
> *I am pretty sure but could be wrong.
> --James
> On Sun, Nov 6, 2011 at 1:03 PM, Ben Hallert - Vipmail <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> wrote:
>
> What about using chemical hand warmers inside the sphere so the environment
> stays hospitable?  I'll be late today btw, still at the house.
>
> - Ben
> On Nov 6, 2011, at 1:00 PM, Rick Osgood <EMAIL HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> Building a secondary tracking system would definitely add redundancy in case
> the primary fails but it will add to cost and complexity as well as weight.
> If you have an idea you'd like to try Kevin I say just go for it. Keep in
> mind a cell phone will only work if it can get a signal. My understanding is
> that above 20000ft you will probably lose signal but if it comes back once
> the payload lands at least we can find it. will we have service at our
> launch/recovery locations though? Who knows at this stage.
> My understanding is that lithium batteries are what you should use
> absolutely. They would be my recommendation as well. They weigh less than
> regular batteries and stand up to cold temperatures better.
> I can't remember for sure if a reflector is required. I know our last
> balloon didn't have one. I think if you stay within the weight restrictions
> you don't need one but I can't recall for sure. of course its dead simple to
> make and include one so perhaps we might as well.
> On Nov 6, 2011 11:28 AM, "Kevin King" <EMAIL HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> Something came up this morning and I will not be able to attend the NSB
> meeting this afternoon.  I have included my notes in hope that a discussion
> will be started on these subjects.  If someone could please take real basic
> notes or an outline of the topics discussed today so that I can rehash with
> Rick on Monday, that would be great.  We could possibly start making brief
> notes for each meeting and post to the wiki for those that can't make the
> meeting.  We could start an agenda for the meetings also.
> 1. Secondary Tracking Device
> 2. Battery Considerations
> 3. Radar Reflector
> -Secondary location device
> In my research I have found many sites that have strongly recommended a
> completely seperate tracking device. in the chance that the primary fails,
> stops transmitting, or battery dies.  I am a huge proponant for redundancy
> and think this would be a good addition to the payload.  We could possibly
> hang it from the primary payload, although that would not be as sexy.  I
> have been looking into both radio beacons and cheap cell phones for this
> purpose.  I have most recently been researching cheap GPS enabled prepaid
> phones with additional software.  One piece of software that I found was
> www.mapmytracks.com.  This would be a simple and cheap way for a backup
> tracking system.
> -Battery Considerations
> Many sites reference using only non rechargable lithium batteries in their
> payload.  When concidering the temperatures found in high altitude (-40C)
> non rechargable lithium batteries are the best choice.  Has anyone else done
> any research on this subject?
> -Radar Reflector
> The last item I have for discussion is whether or not we need to include a
> radar reflector to our payload.  I have found that many near space balloon
> projects include a reflector.  This will make it possible for aircraft to
> detect our balloon.  I thought the FAA guidelines required a reflector,
> however I have seen several balloons that did not include one.
>
> ________________________________
> From: Ben Hallert - Vipmail <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> To: Laura Harris <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> Cc: "EMAIL HIDDEN"
> <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> Sent: Fri, November 4, 2011 1:34:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] Near-space Balloon: A couple more drawings
>
> If we call it Creswell Maker Space, then our enemies would have a more
> difficult time finding us.
> Foolproof!
>
> - Ben
> On Nov 4, 2011, at 11:51 AM, Laura Harris <EMAIL HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> I almost put a break in the line to indicate "some unspecified long length".
> :)
>
> I was going to ask about the name this evening at the shop- I picked up
> 'society' in one of the emails. I'll change all instances.
>
> ________________________________
> From: Rick Osgood <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> To: Laura Harris <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> Cc: "EMAIL HIDDEN"
> <EMAIL HIDDEN>
> Sent: Friday, November 4, 2011 10:38 AM
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] Near-space Balloon: A couple more drawings
>
> Looks good Laura, thanks for working on that.  Looking at the second image
> (the one that includes the balloon) I want to mention that normally people
> tend to stick a 20-30 foot piece of rope between the parachute and the
> balloon.  I can't recall the exact reasons for this but it seems to be the
> usual way of doing things.  I realize it's impractical to include that in a
> diagram like that though.
> Also, I'm not sure where "society" came from but it might be worth
> mentioning that our group's name is actually Eugene Maker Space.
>
> On Fri, Nov 4, 2011 at 10:17 AM, Laura Harris <EMAIL HIDDEN> wrote:
>
> The plan x-section gives a better picture of the reinforcing rib layout. The
> main assy dwg is a statement of the obvious but still nice to see how it all
> goes together :)
>
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