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      Realized there was a neater wiring arrangement.  With no feedback
      it should clock faster, too, all else being equal.<br>
      <br>
      <br>
      <img src="cid:part1.03060407.09040500@efn.org" alt=""><br>
      On 1/16/2014 9:46 AM, Mr. Clif wrote:<br>
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      Wow Darrell,<br>
      <br>
      that is elegant, no inverters.. :-)<br>
      <br>
      <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/16/2014 09:39 AM, Darrell Perko
        wrote:<br>
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          Yeah, I suppose it is normal.  That's what the clock is for
          after all.<br>
          <br>
          Attached is my (messy) schematic.  AND on the left, two XOR on
          right.<br>
          <br>
          <img src="cid:part2.02080804.01060905@efn.org" alt=""><br>
          <br>
          On 1/16/2014 8:58 AM, Mr. Clif wrote:<br>
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          Way to go Darrell!<br>
          <br>
          That sounds perfectly normal except that if I understand you
          correctly you would say that the output of the AND gate
          propagates into the inputs of the XORs.<br>
          <br>
          After I went to bed last night I realized that with the
          MC10H104 I can also do it with three of the four gates in just
          that one package. So not only can I do it in three gates I can
          also do it without buying several different gate packages.<br>
          <br>
          Ok Weston you've got two guys that claim to have solved it in
          three gates! :-p what now?<br>
          <br>
              Clif<br>
          <br>
          <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/16/2014 03:21 AM, Darrell
            Perko wrote:<br>
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              I think I have a solution using two XOR and one AND,
              though the AND is both an output and it feeds back into
              the input of the XORs.  That seems like it could cause
              brief illegal outputs states.<br>
              <br>
              On 1/15/2014 11:49 PM, Mr. Clif wrote:<br>
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              Ok here is a Quad and gate part that you can do it with
              just one package:<br>
              <br>
              MC10H104<br>
              <br>
              there may be others.<br>
              <br>
                  Clif<br>
              <br>
              <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/15/2014 10:40 PM, Mr.
                Clif wrote:<br>
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                Ok ;-)<br>
                <br>
                So when you say that "<span style="font-family:courier
                  new,monospace"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span
                      style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><font
                        face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">inverting
                        operations count as NOT gates</font></span></font></span>"
                do you mean that they aren't counted as gates or that
                they are "Not operations"  implemented as gates, which
                of course they are?<br>
                <br>
                One issue with doing this your way in hardware, is that
                you need three different types of gates unless you are
                doing it in an FPGA or the like.<br>
                <br>
                Here it is in a shorter logical expression:<br>
                <span style="font-family:courier new,monospace">C = <span
                    style="background-color:rgb(255,242,204)">A & B</span>;
                  D = <span style="background-color:rgb(217,234,211)">!C

                    & A</span>; E = <span
                    style="background-color:rgb(207,226,243)">!C & B</span></span><br>
                <br>
                I have another way that uses four of the same kind of
                gate though they may be some what uncommon. ;-)<br>
                <br>
                    Ciao,<br>
                    Clif<br>
                <br>
                <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/15/2014 10:04 PM,
                  Weston Turner wrote:<br>
                </div>
                <blockquote
cite="mid:CAF+j1MNa1jkGiqZovWpQXrdEVthOMwn1aiKmuWt=xb7y2rFTmA@mail.gmail.com"
                  type="cite">
                  <div dir="ltr">
                    <div><span style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><font
                          face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span
                            style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><font
                              face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">From a
                              more rigorous or theoretical standpoint,
                              the inverting operations count as NOT
                              gates</font></span>. But I guess I didn't
                          say that inverting equals a NOT. In any case,
                          my four gate solution doesn't use them. I'll
                          represent it here in Python using four binary
                          bitwise operators, one AND, one OR, and two
                          XORs. <br>
                          <br>
                          A and B are anded to make C<br>
                          A and B are ored  together into the temp
                          variable t<br>
                          t is xored with B to make D<br>
                          t is xored with A to make E<br>
                          <br>
                        </font></span></div>
                    <div><span style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><font
                          face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">The
                          operations are color coded below. Can this be
                          done with fewer operations?<br>
                        </font></span></div>
                    <div><span style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><br>
                        Python 2.7.3 (default, Nov 11 2012, 18:06:39) <br>
                        >>> <b>A, B = 0, 0</b><br>
                        >>> t = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(244,204,204)">A |
                          B</span>; C = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(255,242,204)">A
                          & B</span>; D = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(217,234,211)">B ^
                          t</span>; E = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(207,226,243)">A ^
                          t</span><br>
                        >>> C, D, E<br>
                        <b>(0, 0, 0)</b><br>
                        >>> <b>A, B = 0, 1</b><br>
                        >>> t = A | B; C = A & B; D = B ^
                        t; E = A ^ t<br>
                        >>> C, D, E<br>
                        <b>(0, 0, 1)</b><br>
                        >>> <b>A, B = 1, 0</b><br>
                        >>> t = A | B; C = A & B; D = B ^
                        t; E = A ^ t<br>
                        >>> C, D, E<br>
                        <b>(0, 1, 0)</b><br>
                        >>> <b>A, B = 1, 1</b><br>
                        >>> t = A | B; C = A & B; D = B ^
                        t; E = A ^ t<br>
                        >>> C, D, E<br>
                        <b>(1, 0, 0)</b></span><br>
                      <br>
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                    <div>Cheers,<br>
                    </div>
                    <div>Weston<br>
                    </div>
                    <br>
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                  <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                    <br>
                    <div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 15, 2014 at
                      8:42 PM, Mr. Clif <span dir="ltr"><<a
                          moz-do-not-send="true"
                          href="mailto:clif@eugeneweb.com"
                          target="_blank">clif@eugeneweb.com</a>></span>
                      wrote:<br>
                      <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0
                        0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                        solid;padding-left:1ex">Sure I can do it in
                        three but two of the gates have to have one
                        inverting input each. Since gates often come in
                        quad packs it might be nice to find a circuit
                        that would use all four in a pack. Though if it
                        helps my fourth gate is just an inverter and
                        there are often left over ones from other
                        packages.<br>
                        <br>
                            Clif
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                            <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            On 01/15/2014 07:42 PM, Weston Turner wrote:<br>
                          </div>
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                          0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                          solid;padding-left:1ex">
                          <div>
                            <div class="h5"> I'm wondering if anyone can
                              implement this logic table with less than
                              four gates...<br>
                              <br>
                              A B | C D E<br>
                              -------------<br>
                              0 0 | 0 0 0<br>
                              0 1 | 0 0 1<br>
                              1 0 | 0 1 0<br>
                              1 1 | 1 0 0<br>
                              <br>
                              I figured out a way to implement it with
                              four gates but I'm wondering if it can be
                              reduced further...<br>
                              <br>
                              And if you can only figure out a way to do
                              it with four, then I'm curious to see if
                              you arrived at the same solution I did.<br>
                              <br>
                              Regards,<br>
                              Weston<br>
                            </div>
                          </div>
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