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      Yeah, I was thinking in terms of the most basic gates.  Real-world
      solution with lowest component count trumps.  <br>
      <br>
      On 1/16/2014 12:41 PM, Mr. Clif wrote:<br>
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      So it boils down to how you define gates, are they something you
      buy or something you draw? ;-)<br>
      <br>
      In my curciut it uses one package with four and / nand gates and I
      only use three of them. So there is one left over. One of these
      gates has two outputs which you might say is cheating. However it
      is a real part with just AND gates in it, and you can build your
      circuit with that one chip.<br>
      <br>
      Darrell's solution while it doesn't require an inverter, does
      require two different packages to do it in real life.<br>
      <br>
      So are you implementing this circuit or drawing it? ;-)<br>
      <br>
          Clif<br>
      <br>
      <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/16/2014 12:19 PM, Weston Turner
        wrote:<br>
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        <div>Okay sorry. Clif, you get the prize too I think. But not if
          you count an inverter as a gate (but I haven't looked at the
          IC you specified, and so I don't know exactly what is involved
          in producing the circuit). Care to present a circuit drawing?<br>
          <br>
          Regards,
          <div>Weston</div>
        </div>
        <div><br>
          On Jan 16, 2014, at 11:59 AM, "Mr. Clif" <<a
            moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:clif@eugeneweb.com">clif@eugeneweb.com</a>>

          wrote:<br>
          <br>
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            Um not so fast Weston, my circuit does it with three gates
            in one package with the fourth one left over. <br>
            <br>
                Clif<br>
            <br>
            <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/16/2014 10:49 AM, Weston
              Turner wrote:<br>
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              <div>Yay! Darrell, you get the prize.<br>
                <br>
                Regards,
                <div>Weston</div>
              </div>
              <div><br>
                On Jan 16, 2014, at 3:21 AM, Darrell Perko <<a
                  moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:dperko@efn.org">dperko@efn.org</a>>


                wrote:<br>
                <br>
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                    I think I have a solution using two XOR and one AND,
                    though the AND is both an output and it feeds back
                    into the input of the XORs.  That seems like it
                    could cause brief illegal outputs states.<br>
                    <br>
                    On 1/15/2014 11:49 PM, Mr. Clif wrote:<br>
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                    Ok here is a Quad and gate part that you can do it
                    with just one package:<br>
                    <br>
                    MC10H104<br>
                    <br>
                    there may be others.<br>
                    <br>
                        Clif<br>
                    <br>
                    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/15/2014 10:40 PM,
                      Mr. Clif wrote:<br>
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                      Ok ;-)<br>
                      <br>
                      So when you say that "<span
                        style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><font
                          face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span
                            style="font-family:courier new,monospace"><font
                              face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">inverting

                              operations count as NOT gates</font></span></font></span>"
                      do you mean that they aren't counted as gates or
                      that they are "Not operations"  implemented as
                      gates, which of course they are?<br>
                      <br>
                      One issue with doing this your way in hardware, is
                      that you need three different types of gates
                      unless you are doing it in an FPGA or the like.<br>
                      <br>
                      Here it is in a shorter logical expression:<br>
                      <span style="font-family:courier new,monospace">C
                        = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(255,242,204)">A
                          & B</span>; D = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(217,234,211)">!C
                          & A</span>; E = <span
                          style="background-color:rgb(207,226,243)">!C
                          & B</span></span><br>
                      <br>
                      I have another way that uses four of the same kind
                      of gate though they may be some what uncommon. ;-)<br>
                      <br>
                          Ciao,<br>
                          Clif<br>
                      <br>
                      <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 01/15/2014 10:04
                        PM, Weston Turner wrote:<br>
                      </div>
                      <blockquote
cite="mid:CAF+j1MNa1jkGiqZovWpQXrdEVthOMwn1aiKmuWt=xb7y2rFTmA@mail.gmail.com"
                        type="cite">
                        <div dir="ltr">
                          <div><span style="font-family:courier
                              new,monospace"><font
                                face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span
                                  style="font-family:courier
                                  new,monospace"><font
                                    face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">From

                                    a more rigorous or theoretical
                                    standpoint, the inverting operations
                                    count as NOT gates</font></span>.
                                But I guess I didn't say that inverting
                                equals a NOT. In any case, my four gate
                                solution doesn't use them. I'll
                                represent it here in Python using four
                                binary bitwise operators, one AND, one
                                OR, and two XORs. <br>
                                <br>
                                A and B are anded to make C<br>
                                A and B are ored  together into the temp
                                variable t<br>
                                t is xored with B to make D<br>
                                t is xored with A to make E<br>
                                <br>
                              </font></span></div>
                          <div><span style="font-family:courier
                              new,monospace"><font
                                face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">The
                                operations are color coded below. Can
                                this be done with fewer operations?<br>
                              </font></span></div>
                          <div><span style="font-family:courier
                              new,monospace"><br>
                              Python 2.7.3 (default, Nov 11 2012,
                              18:06:39) <br>
                              >>> <b>A, B = 0, 0</b><br>
                              >>> t = <span
                                style="background-color:rgb(244,204,204)">A
                                | B</span>; C = <span
                                style="background-color:rgb(255,242,204)">A
                                & B</span>; D = <span
                                style="background-color:rgb(217,234,211)">B
                                ^ t</span>; E = <span
                                style="background-color:rgb(207,226,243)">A
                                ^ t</span><br>
                              >>> C, D, E<br>
                              <b>(0, 0, 0)</b><br>
                              >>> <b>A, B = 0, 1</b><br>
                              >>> t = A | B; C = A & B; D =
                              B ^ t; E = A ^ t<br>
                              >>> C, D, E<br>
                              <b>(0, 0, 1)</b><br>
                              >>> <b>A, B = 1, 0</b><br>
                              >>> t = A | B; C = A & B; D =
                              B ^ t; E = A ^ t<br>
                              >>> C, D, E<br>
                              <b>(0, 1, 0)</b><br>
                              >>> <b>A, B = 1, 1</b><br>
                              >>> t = A | B; C = A & B; D =
                              B ^ t; E = A ^ t<br>
                              >>> C, D, E<br>
                              <b>(1, 0, 0)</b></span><br>
                            <br>
                          </div>
                          <div>Cheers,<br>
                          </div>
                          <div>Weston<br>
                          </div>
                          <br>
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                        <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                          <br>
                          <div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 15, 2014
                            at 8:42 PM, Mr. Clif <span dir="ltr"><<a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                href="mailto:clif@eugeneweb.com"
                                target="_blank">clif@eugeneweb.com</a>></span>
                            wrote:<br>
                            <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                              style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
                              #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Sure I can do
                              it in three but two of the gates have to
                              have one inverting input each. Since gates
                              often come in quad packs it might be nice
                              to find a circuit that would use all four
                              in a pack. Though if it helps my fourth
                              gate is just an inverter and there are
                              often left over ones from other packages.<br>
                              <br>
                                  Clif
                              <div>
                                <div class="h5"><br>
                                  <br>
                                  <br>
                                  <br>
                                  <br>
                                  On 01/15/2014 07:42 PM, Weston Turner
                                  wrote:<br>
                                </div>
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                                  <div class="h5"> I'm wondering if
                                    anyone can implement this logic
                                    table with less than four gates...<br>
                                    <br>
                                    A B | C D E<br>
                                    -------------<br>
                                    0 0 | 0 0 0<br>
                                    0 1 | 0 0 1<br>
                                    1 0 | 0 1 0<br>
                                    1 1 | 1 0 0<br>
                                    <br>
                                    I figured out a way to implement it
                                    with four gates but I'm wondering if
                                    it can be reduced further...<br>
                                    <br>
                                    And if you can only figure out a way
                                    to do it with four, then I'm curious
                                    to see if you arrived at the same
                                    solution I did.<br>
                                    <br>
                                    Regards,<br>
                                    Weston<br>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
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